[Grazon]

Hey guys I,m new to the site. Looks great.

I have question for you all. I'm in MN & was wondering I want to improve my plow time & need to get a Back Drag Blade for my plow so Are they available for the poly? & If not has anyone ever fabricated there own? I'm pretty handy at machining & welding so any help would be greatly appreciated.

Have a great Thanksgiving.

Chris Buller
Grazon Snowplowing

 

[Lawngodfather]

I am guessing it would be a safe bet you could tak one from a pro plus and bolt it right on.

 

[Crash935]

Back drag edge from a pro plus wont fit, first the pro plus doesnt come in a 7-6, secondly the bolt pattern is different between the standard - pro and pro plus. Western is not yet making a edge for the standard.

 

[Lawngodfather]

Well, looks like fabrication time....

 

[EZSnow]

a friend of mine has one on his piece of junk- I mean... diamond. It swings free behind the blade, but wont flip under to mimic the angle of the cutting edge. It has stops on it that let it go just a bit forward of center. (but mostly vertical) It scrapes really well, even with this heavy snow we had last weekend. My pro-plus wouldn't backdrag that stuff for more than 5 feet... course I didn't pop for the backdrag edge.

Another style I've seen swings free all the way to follow the cutting edge. I can't figure out how these work any better than the cutting edge itself. Maybe they were just a poor design.

 

[Grazon]

Thanks for thr info guys keep them coming.

E-Z Snow yeah I've seen those that line up with the edge & always wondered if he were any better that the blade itself?

I have a buddy who has them on his Pro Blades but I don't know if they are factory or after market. Guess I'll shoot over & take a look a them see if I can come up with any ideas.

Thanks for the reponses.

Later Chris

 

[wyldman]

I would make one up that hangs off the backside of the blade,and pivots up and down.It will not get in the way when plowing forward,but will really help in backdragging.It will also prevent snow from packing in there,which can happen with a fixed backdrag edge.

The little add on backdrag edge,like used on the Pro plus will help scrape better,but once you get a little snow built up behind the blade,it will still lift up,and not backdrag well.

Whichever way you decide to go,just be careful,as there is no trip in reverse,and you can easily tear the plow off the front of the truck.The Westerns are bad for this due to the weak center pivot area on the a-frame.

 

[BWhite]

Back plows do the best "backdragging "

 

[Bob Van]

Grazon

First of all, Welcome to the site.

Everyone is right. Western is in the process of making them for thier other plows. When? Who knows.

I just ordered a back drag edge from Western Friday AM for my 8' Western Pro. Before I install it, I will see how hard it will be to make several more. The holes and length can be determined later.

Interested, Snowjoker? We can talk later.

I'll let you know how we make out.

 

[Bob Van]

Grazon

What is your location?

 

[Grazon]

Bob Van,

I'm located in the SW Metro Region of Minneapolis,MN.

Well got to look at my buddies plows & He has a couple of different set-ups on his Westerns. Two of his blades swivel right behind the Blade itself with brackets mounted at the bottom behind the blade. The only problem I'm faced with is the Standards are built different, the poly blade uses a square tube at the bottom of the plow instead of an angle iron.

I think I have a good idea on what I need to make one up. I work FT as a Mech. Engineer so right now I'm in the process of getting the bottom of the plow drawn up in CAD & figuring out where I would like to put my swivel points so it will clear the Shoe brackets, & when engaged to back drag that it is angled back slightly to bite into the snow better.

Looks like I'll get some fabrication time this weekend because the weather up here in MN looks like it going to be dry.




I'll keep you posted on what I come up with & try to get some pictures after it is completed. Thanks for the replies

Chris B.
Grazon Snowplowing

 

[EZSnow]

don't get too excited about fabricating, grazon- dave dahl is calling for an alberta clipper thursday-friday.

 

[Grazon]

Here is what I came up with. Do you guys think 3 Swivel points will do the job? The blade will be slightly angled toward the truck when engaged.

 

[EZSnow]

top angled toward the truck or bottom toward the truck? If the bottom is closer to the truck, my first idea is that it might chatter... second idea is that it might not have the right forces to hold it in place... heck- it might even chatter itself out of place!

If you let it travel just a touch over-center, (top closer to the truck) I would think it would "lock in" a little better. Granted, the desired angle-of-attack is cutting-edge first, but this isn't a fixed piece we're talking about here. Of course, the two would use a very similar design, and it probably wouldn't be too difficult to 'adjust' between the two.

BTW- attachment point- I've seen them that use longer cutting edge bolts to secure the hinge brackets on the backside of the blade. It would be less work than drilling a bunch of holes in the base angle, and totally reversible.

 

[JohnnyU]

I might have missed this, but why does it need to pivot?

I don't know why you couldnt get away with a peice of steel that is bent, just like the Western back drag blades for the proplus. Seems like that would do the trick.

I wouldn't waste too much time trying to build a complicated setup, more chance for it to break. My buddy todd (tnt69tnt69, at PS) had one maade at a local machine shop for his poly plow. Seen here I think it only cost him about $60.

 

[wyldman]

You don't want it to flip,or pivot under otherwise the edge will be at the same angle as the original edge,and it will act like a ramp.The blade will just ride up on the snow.

You do need it to pivot some,so it won't catch on anything going forward,and snow doesn't build up under it.

The bent steel that goes under the edge,like on the new Pro-plus blades doesn't do a very good job,and gets packed full of snow.

I usually make them out of an old edge,and just weld an upright at either end to catch the outer plow ribs.I then bolt them on loosely with cheap bolts (3/8") so if you really catch something,it snaps the bolts off,and acts like a saftey mechanism.Carry spare bolts just in case.

You want the edge as high as possible,and at a 45 degree angle or so.The whole purpose is not to scrape,but to act as a wedge,and let the snow building up behind the blade force it down to the ground,so it doesn't lift.The combination of the backdrag blade,and the plow edge will take care of the scraping.

I drill the bolts out for a cotter pin,as you don't want them tight,it need to move around some.Don't forget to drill your spare bolts,and carry a few cotter pins too.

 

[wyldman]

Forgot to add.Whatever you use,just go slow when backdragging,as there is no trip.Westerns do not have a very strong pivot point,and you will tear the nose off the a-frame quite easily.

 

[EZSnow]

I believe I did not communicate effectively.
When I called for the B-D blade to swing under, I meant for it to stand just a *little* past vertical, not to flop under to mimic the angle of the plow blade. There needs to be some stops to prevent it from overtraveling.
Chris, is your design limited to the 45* you mentioned? I understand what you mean about the wedge effect holding the blade down, but wouldn't the snow piling up under the a-frame and quadrant have a similar lift effect?

Standing the B-D blade up gives another few inches to clear more snow underneath- and it scrapes better.

Bottom line- Grazon, you're an engineer. Tell us what the CAD sez. Build it how you like it, just about anything has to be better than the backdrag you get from it now!

BTW- I'm not sure what vintage Western you have on your truck, but if it's an older Uni-Mount, BE CAREFUL BACKDRAGGING. They might as well have a frozen hot dog for a pivot point, and they don't like backdragging too well.

 

[Grazon]

Thanks for the input. CAD is telling me that the bottom of the B-D will be agled toward the truck @ approx. 5 Deg or so.

Wyldman:

I was figuring on using bolts because of that exact same issue there has to be a weak point to enable failure at the pivot points as not to rip the whole Plow from the truck or screw up the A-Frame.


EZSnow:

My Vintage is a 00 Poly & yes that has always been a concern for me at the swivel point. Though I have not yet had any failures there. I have made it a habit to replace that bolt every fall & I always carry spares.

Thanks again & " Let it Snow!!!!"

 

[EZSnow]

when you say 2000, I'm assuming that's a uni-mount. In the last couple years of the uni-mount, they updated the a-frame and quadrant. The newer ones are much stronger. Still not as strong as others, but much better. I had my old uni-mount updated, and I felt it made a big difference in the strength of the pivot point. However, it was an $800 repair as the A frame and quadrant mus tbe replaced together.